Liverpool & South West Lancs Genealogy

[Education Officer]

The Cheshire site mentioned above does not show the marriage in Runcorn for the simple reason they haven't done any transcriptions of Runcorn yet.

It is not the easiest site to use but you can find a list of churches included. The expression dated refers to the date of baptism the other date being that of birth.

It could be that it is all one family that moved about. I wonder if the actual records give an occupation for the father? That is sometimes useful for following a family around.

The ways to see the Runcorn Parish register would be Runcorn library (I think), Cheshire Record Office, possibly Warrington Record Office (I don't know if they have that register on film). It might be worth an email to Runcorn library to see if they would have a quick look for you as you have the date. A copy of the film could be ordered to your local LDS centre. The other alternative would be to ask for a look up on someone may be going somewhere near you never know!!!

Is there an occupation for the father anywhere? If so what is it? Then I'll see if I can think of a way of finding whether they did move around these 3 places.

Hope this helps

Hilary
Ed Officer

[Old-Bonez]

Hi Linda

Everybody (Stirrups) seems to come from the Lancashire & Cheshire area so I was about to try to create a Stirrup family tree of 1700 - 1830 to try to link everybody together.

Census information doesn't go back to that era which leaves me no option but to do it all from parish records

Luckily the Lancashire parish records are apparently all available freely on the net and Cheshires records are in the process of being completed so it will basically be a task of logging down all the stirrups and sorting out the pieces of this jigsaw puzzle even though many pieces will be missing and they may be very big pieces indeed.

Yes I would LOVE to have another researcher involved in this. I'll send you a PM with my direct addy


Hello Hilary
Many thanks for confirming those items.

Apparently Phebe's father Thomas was a labourer which was probably the reason for their continued relocations. I imagine he worked on building sites so wherever his friends found a new work site he would follow.

I am working on a timeline of births of possible siblings to try to make sence of it:

2 May 1799 Parents Thomas Stirrup married Mary Cloweth in All Saints, Runcorn, Cheshire.

27 Mar 1800 Birth of John Baptised 20 Apr 1800, St Mary the Virgin, Lymm, Cheshire.

6 Nov 1802 Baptism of Mary at St Mary the Virgin, Leigh, Lancashire.

13 May 1805 Birth of Peter Baptised 9 Jun 1805, St Mary the Virgin, Lymm, Cheshire.

25 Oct 1807 Baptism of Phebe at St Elphin, Warrington, Lancashire.


Please remember that these are only "possible" siblings to Phoebe

Oh ... does anybody have any ideas on how to trace her mothers family... "Mary Cloweth" It appears to be a very rare name and possibly a misspelling. (how I miss not being able to search Runcorn where she was married)

Regards, Rob

[Education Officer]

Please be aware that not all Lancashire Parish Registers are available on the web. There are very many that are not. You may wish to get a film ordered at your LDS centre. Also remember that not all transcriptions actually transcribe everything that is actually in the register

Is your man an agricultural labourer/farm labourer or just labourer?

Not sure if the laws regarding place of settlement were still in use at this time. It might be something you wish to look into.


Hilary
Ed Officer

[Old-Bonez]

From a find in the Lancs Transcripts he is listed as "labourer". Yes I admit that this could mean anything but I'd imagine that as a farm labourer the work would be very seasonal and little need to travel around that far whereas I'd imagined construction work would have him moving from site to site. I'll accept being corrected on this assumption.

There is another Phoebe Stirrup b.1806 in Burtonwood. Here is her family so we don't get confused:

Husband: William Stirrup. Birth: About 1769 Of, Burtonwood, Lancashire,
Wife: Alice Stirrup. Birth: About 1773 Of, Burtonwood, Lancashire,

Children
1. Mary Stirrup. Christening: 13 DEC 1795 Burtonwood, Lancashire,
2. William Stirrup. Christening 1 OCT 1797 Burtonwood, Lancashire,
3. Peter Stirrup. Christening 5 JAN 1800 Burtonwood, Lancashire,
4. James Stirrup. Christening: 05 JAN 1800 Burtonwood, Lancashire,
5. Pheobe Stirrup. Christening: 29 JUN 1806 Burtonwood, Lancashire,
6. Ellen Stirrup. Christening 1 MAY 1808 Burtonwood, Lancashire,
7. Margaret Stirrup. Christening: 2 JUL 1809 Burtonwood, Lancashire,
8. Thomas Stirrup. Christening: 15 SEP 1811 Burtonwood, Lancashire,
9. Martha Stirrup. Christening: 28 NOV 1813 Burtonwood, Lancashire,

My knowledge on her mother "Mary Cloweth" is minimal. The Cloweth name is an unusual one and in the early part of last century was restricted to a small area in south Lancashire, Astley and Leigh (C.W.Bardsley: "Dictionary of English and Welsh Surnames").

Regards, Rob

[Education Officer]

I have a copy of the Lancashire Parish Register Society volume 155 The registers of Leigh 1701 - 1753. As this covers the area you mention for Cloweth I had a look. There is no Cloweth but it groups together the surnames Cleworth Cleworh Cluorth Cluworth which may help with the search for ancestry of the name Cloweth which I guess is an altered version of Cleworth. At a time when people couldn't read or write and had very local accents you can imagine how it got altered.

Searching on www.lan-opc.org.uk with Cleworth gives many hits.


Hilary
Ed Officer

[Old-Bonez]

Linda.

Whilst I'm stalled putting data into an Access file to assist sorting out the 1036 Lancs Parish Clerks finds lets take a look at your William.

You must have more information on him such as a marriage. You gave us "William died in Liverpool in 1849 age 36" which gives us a birth of abt 1813.

Using the Lancs site this reveals 2 possible Williams
Baptisms: 18 Apr 1813 St Elphins, Warrington, Lancashire, England
William Stirrup - Son of Thomas Stirrup & Alice
Abode: Bank Quay
Occupation: Fustian Cutter
Baptised by: J Topping Curate
Register: Baptisms 1813 - 1818, Page 17, Entry 134
Source: LDS Film 1562959

Baptisms: 28 Jan 1815 St Mary the Virgin, Leigh, Lancashire, England
William Stirrup - Son of Betty Stirrup
Abode: Bedford
Occupation: Single woman
Baptised by: D. Birkett
Register: Baptisms 1813 - 1818, Page 112, Entry 889
Source: LDS Film 1885647

There may also be finds in Cheshire

Do you have a marriage for him??

Regards, Rob

[peterd]

dont know if this link will help you ?

http://www.csc.liv.ac.uk/~cprdb/
_________________
membership no 7667
Dorricott. Watterson. Evans. Bracegirdle. Quinn. Mcloughlin
http://www.deneview.co.uk/ http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/

[Old-Bonez]

Thanks Peter
I've also been looking at that site trying to see if there is a way I can also automatically bring their data into the same Access file I'm creating. Rather tricky it seems but when complete I'll be able to search the "stirrup" family as well as it's spelling varients using any combinations I like.

It is very handy to be able to search bulk parishes like Lancs and Cheshire

Everything I've tried so far leads me to about 4 basic familys without linking any one to the other.

I'll probably be able to link into Lindas line too.

It's tougher than I thought but I'm persisting.

Rob

[wilfiedog]

I am not related to this lady but she has come up in research on another family.
Phoebe(aka Elisabeth) appears to have married Peter McAlpin. It looks like they purchased land in Muswellbrook, New south Wales in the name of Phoebe's daughter Harriet Cole on 30/5/1840. Harriet was 7 years old at the time. Peter was still around in June 1841 as he was summonsed to appear in a court case in Muswellbrook but was not around when the 1841 census was taken showing Phoebe as head of the household.
In 1850 Mrs Mildred Ellis (my ancestor) opened an inn "Fitz Roy Hotel" in Muswellbrook lately occupied by Mrs Phoebe McAlpin Baker and Confectioner.In 1863 "I Phoebe Wingrave, wife of Frederick Wingrave of Windeyer near Mudgee in the Colony of N.S.W, storekeeper, the mother of said Henry Richard Cloweth McAlpin" on land records dated 9/10/1863.
Phoebe was in Windeyer by 31/3/1852 when she married Frederick Wingrave, she described herself as a widow and gave her maiden name as Cloweth (Peter McAlpin was still alive).
This sounds like your lady

[Old-Bonez]

Yes this is indeed the same lady.
I am getting close to completing my research on this ever elusive woman.
I have come across Mrs Ellis taking over from Phoebe McAlpin (whom she would have been known as at that time). Would you had any other details here on where the premises were?
She came to Australia as convict Elizabeth Harrison and it has been hard work to find that she was born Phoebe Stirrup 1807 Warrington Lancs.
I now have all her land purchases including the ones in her childrens names.
Looking back through her life she has used many names both illegally and legally.
Phebe Stirrup
Jane Webster
Elizabeth Harrison
Elizabeth Scols/Cowle/Cowles/Cole/Coles
Elizabeth/Phoebe McAlpin
Elizabeth/Phoebe Cloweth
Phoebe Wingrave
If you'd like to know more feel free to contact me using a Personal Message and we'll exchange email addresses so you can obtain her full story