John Thomas Mallen (Mallon) Birth details

[Blue70]

I agree with the theory that George wasn't married to John's mother. There's a George Dobbs aged 17 in 1881 he's a young man. He married someone else in 1884. On Ancestry's 1891 Census there's a transcription error. John should be George and George should be Margaret. The crossings out have been mis-transcribed. Here's this George Dobbs' marriage:-

Name: Georgium Dobbs
Marriage Date: 27 Aug 1884
Parish: Holy Cross
Spouse's Name: Margaritam Ginley
Father's Name: Michaelis Dobbs
Mother's Name: Mariae Dobbs
Spouse Father's Name: Patritii Ginley
Spouse Mother's Name: Birgittae Ginley


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[dickiesam]

Re:

Trouble is that Catholics were pretty strict on that. Not too sure if the child would have been allowed to be baptised without them being married.

My paternal great g.father and great g.mother had 7 children all born and baptised in Dublin between 1864 and 1875. They were not married and it is apparent that no evidence of a marriage was required. They were both practicing RC and they didn't actually marry until 1885 in the Liverpool Registry Office, a year after his 'legal' spouse had died in Ireland. He had married her in in Limerick in 1854 before going to the Crimea with the 31st (Huntingdonshire) Regiment of Foot. He came home wounded and discharged from further service to find he had a son. Except the child had been born 10 months after he had sailed to the Crimea!

[Blue70]

The birth might not have been registered so the baptism alone might be your evidence of parentage.


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[toekneem]

...............
It is possible John Mallon did not know his father's name if he was illegitimate, for instance. George might have been a name to put into an otherwise embarrassing blank space on the register. Is there an indication on the marriage cert that George Mallon was deceased?

Just realised something bugged me. Can understand illegitimacy in those days, so might have thought of a name but why put "Boiler Scaler" as an occupation.

[dickiesam]

Re:

Just realised something bugged me. Can understand illegitimacy in those days, so might have thought of a name but why put "Boiler Scaler" as an occupation.

If George Dobbs was indeed John's father perhaps his occupation was that of 'boiler scaler', a relatively common job back then. John's mother Elizabeth may have told him his father's name was George and that he was a boiler scaler. In order to 'simplify' her life and relationship with her son, I suspect she also told him that George had died. The absence of the word 'Deceased' on John's marriage cert could mean the question 'Is your father still living' wasn't asked. Happened all too frequently.

[Alison C]

Does it give an occupation for George Dobbs on the 1891 census?

I have tried finding him in 1901 and 1911 with no luck

There is a death registration for Margaret Dobbs in 1897 on FreeBMD so George was a widower by the 1901 census:

Deaths March 1897
DOBBS Margaret
Age: 30
District: Liverpool
Vol: 8b
Page: 57

If John was living with George and Margaret in 1891 , then that suggests that Elizabeth died sometime between 1882 and 1891 - but no sign of a death registration for her. Also, I can't see any sign of her on the 1881 census to give an idea of age, place of birth etc

Alison

[dickiesam]

Hi Alison,
Re

If John was living with George and Margaret in 1891, then that suggests that Elizabeth died sometime between 1882 and 1891 - but no sign of a death registration for her. Also, I can't see any sign of her on the 1881 census to give an idea of age, place of birth etc

1891: RG12 Piece: 2903 Folio: 122 Page: 9 - Address: 14 Tindall Street, Liverpool.
Fairly sure the child in the Dobbs family in 1891 is indeed a George not John and the forename error on the Summary Page only applied to the Father, George. Probably a mistake by the enumerator when transferring the data from the Household return.
Births Mar 1890: Dobbs, George Liverpool 8b 47

[Blue70]

1891 Census

Name: George Dobbs
Age: 27
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1864
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name:  Margaret Dobbs
Gender:  Male
Where born: Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Liverpool
Ecclesiastical parish: St James the Less
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street Address: 14 Tindal Street
Occupation: Dock Labourer
Condition as to marriage: Married
Registration District: Liverpool
Sub-registration District: St Martin
ED, institution, or vessel: 30
Piece: 2903
Folio: 122
Page Number: 9
Household Members:
Name/Age/Status/Birthplace
George Dobbs: 27, Head, Liverpool
Margaret Dobbs: 25, Wife, Liverpool
Michael Dobbs: 5, Son, Liverpool
Thomas Dobbs: 4, Son, Liverpool
George Dobbs: 1, Son, Liverpool
Bridget Ginley: 49, Mother in Law, Widow, Boarder, Castlebar, Ireland


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[Blue70]

Maybe George Dobbs went to sea. This could be his death unfortunately the RC burial record only gives St Joseph's Home (RC old people's home in Belmont Road) as his address:-

Name: George Dobbs
Birth Date: abt 1863
Date of Registration: Oct/Nov/Dec 1944
Age at Death: 81
Registration District: Liverpool North
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8b
Page: 267


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