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I agree, it would be worth considering that perhaps they were cousins.
MaryA Our Facebook Page
Names - Lunt, Hall, Kent, Ayre, Forshaw, Parle, Lawrenson, Longford, Ennis, Bayley, Russell, Longworth, Baile
Any census info in this post is Crown Copyright, from National Archives
I'm back a couple of generations from there.
William Tatlock Chippendall/Chippindall was born about 1774 in Liverpool, died Queanbeyan, NSW, on 7 July 1839. I have had no luck with trying to find out more about his birth and parentage.
He married Thomas Rushton's daughter Henrietta (born about 1786 in Liverpool, died Campbelltown near Sydney on 11 Mar 1817). The wedding was in Liverpool on 17 Dec 1811. It seems that starting the family preceded the wedding.
They sailed to Australia with their family on the Hebe in 1815.
John Giles Chippendall, their eldest son, was born at Orage (?) Moor, Lancashire, in 1807 or 1809. In Australia he married Margaret Dowse (Douse), the daughter of another convict, Isaac Dowse, who was born at Keevil in Wiltshire and was sentenced in the Old Bailey for stealing a horse. (No Lancashire connection there).
They had a son named William Tatlock Chippendall, the same as his grandfather. He is the one born in 1845 who married Fanny Sample Howlett and died in 1920. His sister Henrietta married William John Tress and I am descended from them.
Your confusion stems solely from their lack of imagination in choosing names for their children!
I have just had an email from another descendant here in Australia who says: "William Chippindall was never William Tatlock Chippindall. It is something that someone put on Ancestry many years ago and it has grown like topsy."
So the answer to your question would be: Apparently not! Thanks for that, and sorry that I assumed you were confusing two WTCs when there was only one -- your one -- in the first place. Geoff
The birth date of 1807 (or 1809) comes from his age on the Hebe passenger list in 1815 and some NSW general musters in later years (they vary slightly). My guess is that someone looking for more on him found the 1861 English Census and saw there was a family living at No 3 Howard St with the head of the house a John Chippendale, married, 54, labourer, born Orage Moor Lancashire, and assumed wrongly that this was John Giles Chippendall, who of course had been in Australia since 1815. So on my tree I have kept the date but ditched the place.
A kind woman in Canberra (a third cousin once removed) has sent me her quite extensive research on the Rushtons and the Chippendalls. She hasn't got back any further with Thomas Rushton but she has got very useful information on the Chippendalls. She has been to the area and spoken to relatives there, and has the church records etc so is very reliable.
William Chippendall was William Coward Chippendall, named after his mother Ellinor Coward (1756- ). She married John Chippendall (1742-82), who was the son of William Chippingdale and Elizabeth Bleasdale, the daughter of Giles Beasdale. That's where the Giles family name comes from. William Chippingdale died crossing Morecambe Sands in 1765 or 1766. And so on back, which no doubt will be more interesting to you to than to you.
Some of the localities she mentions are Ulverston, Mitton, Bashal Eaves, Chipping and Waddington. That will mean more to you than to me, although I have looked most of them up on a map.
The man who died on the Sands was buried at Poulton Le Sands. I'm not sure if that is the same as Bolton Le Sands, which I had encountered earlier chasing a red herring down a burrow, as it were.
By the way, it seems the name "William Tatlock Chippendall" was what his son John Giles Chippendall gave for his death certificate, so we can't blame it all on other people's trees!
The antecedents of Thomas Rushton will just have to remain elusive, but thanks to all the forum members for all the help you have generally offered along my journey
Geoff
Apparently if the son gave that name on the death certificate, William Chippendall must have used the name himself. Often I find, although it's usually with females, that trees posted by Americans tend to add the maiden name in before the married name seemingly more as an identification than anything, and we find it confusing assuming that it is a legitimate name that the person used.
Check your map for Poulton Le Fylde, I would think Poulton Le Sands would be as near a match as possible.
Considering the places you name, I'm wondering if you might gain some help from a Society slightly further north than ourselves, as they may have more local knowledge. Try https://www.lfhhs.org.uk/
MaryA Our Facebook Page
Names - Lunt, Hall, Kent, Ayre, Forshaw, Parle, Lawrenson, Longford, Ennis, Bayley, Russell, Longworth, Baile
Any census info in this post is Crown Copyright, from National Archives
I didn't have the first John. But I also had two not included there, which seems odd.
Robert Rushton died on 18 Nov 1789 and was buried 21 Nov 1789 . He was two days old.
Eliza Rushton died on 12 Jul 1794 and was buried on 15 Jul 1794 . She was four months old.
George (died 1792) comes between Robert and Eliza and he is there on your list, so you would expect the others to be there as well.
I am having good results in tracing the Chippindall-Bleasdale line up around Chipping, Ulverston and Morecambe Bay but still haven't got any further with Amelia Tatlock, other than that her mother was Ann (thanks for that), or Thomas Rushton, my original query. If he was Edward Rushton's brother then his father was Liverpool victualler Thomas (senior) Rushton. But there is no evidence for that hypothesis, other than that Thomas made beer and Edward sold beer at one stage, among many other pursuits.
I followed up your suggestion about contacting the Lancashire Family History & Heraldry Society chasing the Chippindall line. I also have found some other contacts which took me back to a 1579 Chippindall will (with English transcription, thankfully) and we are awaiting a copy of a Chancery document from UK Archives that mentions a Chippindall marriage. I think I have firmed up Thomas Rushton's birth date as being most likely being 1744 (there are several alternative calculations) so the 31 Mar 1745 baptism at St Peter's (son of Robert Rushton, of Atherton St, labourer) is the most likely that I have found. He was apparently at Macclesfield when his bankruptcy was discharged, which is additional to the material you gave me earlier. I have now gone back to concentrating on his wife Amelia Tatlock. I believe her parents were married at St Peter's on 25 Jun 1757, described as John Tatlock, Liverpool, Gentleman and Ann Jameson, Huyton, Spinster. Amelia was born two years later and we know her mother was Ann Tatlock (she gave permission for Amelia to marry at age 15). The marriage bond gives the ages for John and Ann as 21, which means they were born about 1736. I think John was baptised at Our Lady and St Nicholas on 7 Aug 1734. If that is correct his father was Henry Tatlock of Martindale Hill, whitesmith. The only other information I have found is that there was a Henry Tatlock buried at St Peter's on 5 Jan 1746. He is described as Henry Tatlock - Occupation: Smith. This could well be John's father Henry, since both Henrys were smiths. So the search continues. Thanks for your help in the past and if anyone has anything to add re the Tatlocks that would be appreciated. I gather there were several Liverpool clergymen named Tatlock around this time, but they may not be close relations. Likewise I am steering away from families at places such as Ormskirk and Preston. Geoff Turner
Also, Gore's Directory for 1773 includes Ann Tatlock, brewer, Dale St, and Edward Tatlock, brewer, Dale St. Thomas Rushton is not listed as a brewer in 1773 but is in the directory in 1790 as a brewer at 26 Dale St. Perhaps he married into his mother-in-law's business. Not sure who Edward Tatlock would be, probably too early to be her son, so perhaps Ann's brother-in-law. Geoff
There was an Edward Tatlock, yeoman, of Liverpool, married at St Peter's in 1760 to Elizabeth Fairclough, spinster, of Walton. Both bride and groom were 40 years old and upwards. If this was the Edward Tatlock mentioned in Gore's Directory it is more likely to have been John's uncle than his brother. I have also been made aware that at this time many Liverpool "brewers" were simply inn-keepers who brewed enough for their establishments and a little more.
Very interesting about the man dying crossing Morecambe Bay. Not sure if you know but that whole area is tidal quick sands which shift over the years with the tides. I lived on the other side of the bay until a few years ago. Opposite me was Arnside which was historically quick sands and on my side Grange over Sands was a beach with sailing boats in Victorian times, over the years with the shifts it has completely reversed. Some people do walk on the sands in parts but I was never brave enough. They say locally that whole coaches and horses are lost down there. In olden times there would be guides such as monks appointed to help people to make the crossing.
There is a man appointed as the official Queen's Guide to the Sands and for some times in the year he will lead walks on the sands for a small charge for charity.
Thanks Barbara, I have sent you a private message about the sands. More generally, I have located the 1763 will for John Tatlock, father of Rushton's wife Amelia Tatlock, which has been very informative. He mentions his father-in-law by name which confirms Amelia's mother was born Ann Jameson. He also mentions his children Ralph and Emmy. John Tatlock died young (at 29) and Amelia was only about 4 when he wrote his will, so it makes sense that he would use a diminutive of her name. It also confirms that Thomas Rushton married into a family of brewers. Rushton's own family, however, remains elusive. Geoff
