Bridget O'Brien/Clate

[mavis]

All the information I posted I had wrote in a book for some chap called O'Brien from Australia who I assisted at the Liverpool Record Office, must be about 10 to 15 years ago. I got stuck on looking for her 3rd marriage as he said she was married to someone called Smith. So I was looking for a death of Bridget Smith. I should have the address somewhere for Mr. O'Brien. I'll see if I can dig it out.

Katie I don't know if the Bernard O'Brien is still alive but I'm going to send him a letter, thanks for the tip, Mavis

[mavis]

Hi Mavis,

If you are signed in to Ancestry, the link should take you to the marriage.

Thanks I found it,

Could you help me find out when Bridget was Born, I have her birth date as 1842 born Passage East Waterford Ireland Father John Murphy mother Ellen Murphy, I have tried every way to track down all roads, and I have come up short I was surprised to find out she was married in Liverpool but I "know" she was born in Ireland, I have found out when looking for my Ancestors that I have to forget what I was told by my mother and just do the checking ---- to bad they didn't have computers 100 years ago ---- thanks goodness for the Internet, If you could help me it would fit in a few pieces, I know Liverpool and Ireland have so many Bridget Murphy's John Murphy and even Ellen Murphy's I do know her father was John from her marriage certificate and I know her mother was Ellen from a 1871 census but I can find no trace of her or her mother or father before then, any help will be appreciated, thanks Mavis

[Bertieone]

Hi Mavis,

Just a possibility to throw in to the mix or perhaps the bin.

We know Ellen Murphy, widow, 59, was living with Daniel O'Brien and Bridget, 1871,
RG10, P3778, F98, P62.

1861, Ellen Murphy, 49, widow, servant, Born, Ireland,
John Fennel and son,
RG9, P2658, F38, P4.

Prior to her marriage in Sept 1861 to Daniel, Bridget has to be somewhere,
1861, transcribed as Bitchat Mulfee, 20, Born, Ireland, living with her married sister, Catherine Gerrits.
RG9 P2677, F91, P28.

Catherine married Konrad?? Gerrits, Mariner, at St Davids, Liverpool., 20 Sept 1854,
Father, John Murphy, Shoemaker.

John Murphy's occupation conflicts with what Bridget has always declared but people did change occupations, I would have also expected a catholic marriage for Catherine, though perhaps not with her husband being Dutch, Though he did receive a Catholic burial in 1891, Koewraad Gerrits.

One of the witnesses at Bridget/Daniel marriage was Keowraad Gerritts?

Catherine's first born was Ellen,

Further investigation me thinks.

[mavis]

Thanks Bert, its 5am in Washington USA so I will digest the information you gave me over a cup of coffee, will be back in a few hours, thanks again, Mavis

[mavis]

Hello Bert, many thanks for the information on Bridget's sister Catherine, Ellen must be a "family name" because my mother's middle name is also Ellen, her mother was one of Bridget's children born Liverpool 1867, is Bitchat Mulfee the same as Bridget Murphy? if so why spell it that way, I had a hard enough time with the spelling on her wedding papers, it sounds like Catherine was quite a bit older than Bridget ----any ideas how I can look up information when John and Ellen Murphy were either born or married, I know it had to be in Ireland, thanks for the help Mavis

[Bertieone]

Hi, Mavis,

Yes, Britchat Mulfee is Bridget Murphy, its just a transcription error, the transcriber has seen it as that on the original census form and recorded it. Some of the Enumerators had difficulty with spelling, and the writing implements didn't help.
Many people had different accents which were hard to understand, many knew their name but couldn't spell it, an unfamiliar name, the Enumerator would have to give it his best shot at spelling it, not always correctly.

The Catholic Marriages and Baptisms were often recorded in Latin, again with bad hand writing, difficulty is imposed upon us.

So far I have been unable to find John/Ellen marriage or Bridget's birth, I'm sure others have looked also. Unfortunately, not an easy task.
There are some Irish Genealogy sites, pay per view/credits, that may help. Hopefully, advice will come from those who have used them.

I still think there are siblings of Bridget and Catherine to find which may help the cause.

[mavis]

Thanks again,
I tried looking for births of Bridget and Catherine yesterday in Ireland but looking at a page and a half of John Murphy's with a wife named Ellen I gave up, I will start checking and see if I can find out what Ellen's last name was --- that should narrow the search a little, I think I will be thankful that I was able to trace Bridget's life to 3 husbands and found she was buried in Ford cemetery, the people on this site have been so helpful, thank you all again, Mavis.

[mavis]

Katie, I want to tell you the address in Australia you gave me a while back I sent them a letter and I received an email last night ---- I don't know if you remember but my great grandfather Daniel O'Brien & Bridget Murphy had many children and it seems at least 3 of them ended up in Australia Mary O'Brien married a Gustav Schmidt and when they move to Australia Mary's brothers Daniel & John also moved there so now I know we have relatives called O'Brien living in Australia --- many thanks Katie, the information you remembered from 10-15 years ago paid off, thenak again, Mavis

[MaryA]

What a great result Mavis, very well done, I'm so pleased for you.

[Katie]

Glad to be of assistance say Guday the the O'Brien family in Aussie.

[mavis]

Will do Katie, the O'Brien said he would have got in touch with you if you, if he knew you were still around, I informed him you were a great help with the Liverpool group, thanks again Mavis

[mavis]

PS Katie ---- did I forget to tell you the man who was hunting down the information on the O'Brien is Bernie [ I believe his last name must be Bowler] and he is my 2nd cousin [ we both have the same great grandfather Daniel O'Brien who was married to Bridget Murphy, ] small world, he didn't know about my Uncle Hermann Neuling moving to Australia so I gave him more information on the family, it must have been around 1999-2000 that he did all his research on the family at the records office , thanks again, Mavis

[mavis]

Hello,

Katie I know you have answered some of my questions on Bridget and her 3 husbands, I received a message from Bernard O'Brien in Australia asking if I or anyone knows when Bridget's 2nd husband William Tjaden died, I have looked in all the "right places" but came up zero, I know by looking at the information I received that they have spelled her married name a few different ways, and trying to find information on a Bridget Murphy or Bridget O'Brien I find they have so many of them, any help would be appreciated, Ancestery.com here in the USA isn't much help. Thanks again, Mavis

[Blue70]

Is this him?

Name: William Tjaden
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1837
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1892
Age at Death: 55
Registration District: Toxeth Park
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8b
Page: 183



Blue

[mavis]

Blue 70 you are a GEM, thanks for the quick reply I will get on the computer and send Bernard O'Brien in Australia the good news he is an O'Brien tracing his family tree from Ireland, and I "found" him through Katie, he is a relation of mine and were both searching the same information ---- I wish I could send the money to the Liverpool group that I have to send to Ancestry over here in the USA, the information I find on their website over here doesn't compare with the information I receive from you good people, many thanks for the information. Mavis

[Blue70]

William and Bridget's marriage record is on Ancestry have you got a copy of the image? The marriage was at Holy Trinity, Toxteth on 10 April 1883.


Blue

[mavis]

Thanks I have the church records I don't try and purchase birth, marriage or death certificates from the registry office in Liverpool as the money exchange is a mess, thanks again, Mavis

[mavis]

Hello Katie,
I want to thank you again for sending me the address of Bernard O'Brien in Australia,we have been in "email contact" with each other we found out that Daniel & Bridget are our great grand parents, plus he had some information passed on from one of his aunts that he shared with me that way I was able to "fill in a lot of the blanks" -- I never thought I would get to find out much about my ancestors, but hunting dates and places a person can find a lot about them -- by the way Bernard was writing a short book about his ancestors and he sent me a copy --- Catherine O'Brien [ Neuling] is/was my grandmother and her brother Daniel O'Brien [ one of Daniel's and Bridget's children] is Bernard's grandfather, it was one of Daniels daughters who gave Bernard the information she had on the O'Brien family from Waterford. My husband and I are planning a trip to Liverpool next year and I hope I can find some more information about the rest of the family, Katie this group of people are "the BEST" I have received more information from you than I can ever find on Ancestry.com

[MaryA]

Well done Mavis, I'm so pleased you have made contact with family members and found out so many details of your family.

[Katie]

It was a team effort Mavis. I never throw research notes out. Say Hi to Bernard for me.