Puzzled over address listing

[dennison]

Hi, looking up Michael Henry d Jan 4th 1898 in the Liverpool, England, Catholic Burials, can anybody shed light on why no address is listed. The entry states;

Name Residence Age
Jan4 Michael Henry Lpool Coroner 56 years

The entries above him all give addresses so im a little puzzled as to why the Coroner is named as residence.
The entry below him is

Jan 4 Martin Ryan Bootle Hospital 48years

So could that be read as Lpool Coroner Bootle Hospital for the both of them or would they be separate entries?
Any help appreciated;
Thanks Chris.

[Katie]

When it says Coroners Order, it means a Coroners Inquest was held.

This may be reported in the Liverpool Mercury which may give you his address and details of death.

[Blue70]

I can't find a mention in the local newspaper, Liverpool Mercury. Liverpool Record Office have Inquest Registers on microfilm for 1898 although not the full case records. The microfilm entry will have the date, place and cause of death similar to the contents of the death certificate. If the inquest was in December 1897 then unfortunately that year is not available on microfilm. If ordering the death certificate this appears to be the death index:-

Name: Michael Henry
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1898
Age at Death: 56
Registration District: Toxteth Park
Volume: 8b
Page: 127

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/


Blue

[dennison]

Thanks Katie and Blue, looks like the register of the death on Jan 4th means the inquest would most likely been in the December of 1897 and not available as you say, so ill get the death cert and see what I can glean, hopefully his spouses name which would be of help.

Also I was wondering whether maybe he was an itinerant and living rough, or in the workhouse , hence no address.

As a matter of interest Blue where do you look for the information from the Liverpool Mercury ?
Thanks Chris.

[Blue70]

Just checked again and January 1898 issues for Liverpool Mercury don't seem to be available on the site I used so don't rule out an 1898 inquest. I use a Lancs library card to access Gale's 19th century newspapers. No sign on FMP or British Newspaper Archive sites either it looks like the relevant issue date-wise is not available on any of these sites.


Blue

[Tina]

I'll ask my friend to see who else is buried in grave 2167 at Ford.

[MaryA]

There are a few others Tina, it appears to be a general grave.

[Tina]

Tx Mary

[dennison]

Thanks Mary and Tina, when you say a general grave with others i take it you dont mean other family members? Is it a grave for the poor who couldnt afford a burial or people who had no family? Please excuse my ignorance. My 2nd great grandfather Michael is proving elusive, he marries Rosanna Field in 1872, both living in Clayton St, living there for at least 19 years till the 1891 census. On both the 1881 and 1891 Rosanna is deemed married although Michael is not on any census.
They had four children in 1891 still at home also Rosannas brother and his family living with them, there seemed to be quite a large family network around.
So would the Michael who died in 1898 not of have had some kind family grave rather than the general grave you mention given a supposedly large family around? Unless circumstances had changed somewhat since the 1891 census.
Ill order the cert and see what it brings.
Thanks once again and be gentle with me i,m still learning...lol

Chris

[MaryA]

Some graves were purchased, and perhaps continued in the family when required. Others sadly couldn't afford to purchase a grave but many would still have paid for the funeral though.

Often confused with a "paupers" grave, in both cases other burials than family would be found in the plot, generally buried within a few days of each other.

[dickiesam]

On both the 1881 and 1891 Rosanna is deemed married although Michael is not on any census.
They had four children in 1891 still at home also Rosanna's brother and his family living with them, there seemed to be quite a large family network around.

What was Michael's occupation on the marriage cert when he married Roseanna?

And this appears to be the marriage from FreeBMD. Is the name Field a typo?
Marriages Dec 1872: Henry, Michael married O'REILLY, Roseanna - Liverpool 8b 446

[dennison]

Thanks Mary I wondered why there were graves with multiple people in them, I have a 1st cousin 1removed who died age 4 and found that she was in a grave with seven others, the plot in the cemetery was away from the catholic area and general burial areas all on its own next to a rhododendron bush. Apparently the others were either stillborn or only a few months old and I was told that because they hadn't been baptised they couldn't be buried in consecrated ground and this in 1943...sad.

Michaels occupation on his marriage cert is that of Painter, Michaels wife Rosanna,s maiden name was Field, she was born in Liverpool but then moved to Dublin where she married a John OReilly/Reilly and had 3 children one of which Mary, was back living with her mother in 1901, I don't know what became of John but on her marriage cert she is a widow, so after her last child born Dublin in
1862 and 1872 when she married Michael, John OReilly has died and she has moved back to Liverpool.
Cheers for the help
Chris

[dickiesam]

Hi Chris,
More questions....
It would appear that you have not found Michael in any census?
What was his given age on his marriage cert?
Is his occupation simply shown as 'Painter' or is there any indication of what 'sort' of painter he was?
What was his father's name/occupation and do you have Michael's birth cert to confirm his place and YoB?

[dennison]

Hi DS, yes that is the problem I haven,t found him in any census, the information I have is off his marriage cert;
M 1872
Age 28
Painter
Father- Michael-deceased - occupation - farmer
And off the Liverpool Catholic marriages
Mother - Brigit
Then it is just on the 1881 and 1891 censuses where Rosanna is noted as being Married.
I haven,t found a birth yet
Thanks Chris

[dickiesam]

In 1871.... RG10 Piece 3918 Folio 62 Page 21
MICHAEL HENRY - LODGER 26 1845 Painter's labourer - Co. Sligo, IRELAND
Address: 126 KING STREET, FARNWORTH, LANCS.

In another direction...
Is Michael a bachelor or a widower when he married in 1872? There's a marriage on Familysearch that could fit if a widower...
Name: Michael Henry
Birth Date: 1841
Age: 25
Spouse's Name: Nancy Rogers
Spouse's Birth Date: 1841
Spouse's Age: 25
Event Date: 25 Jan 1866
Event Place: Magherafelt, Londonderry, Ireland
Father's Name: Michael Henry
Spouse's Father's Name: Michael Rogers
Marital Status: Single
Spouse's Marital Status: Single

[dennison]

Thanks DS, I had spotted this Michael in Farnworth,Bolton and its not beyond the realms that between the April Census of 1871 and Michaels marriage in Nov 1872 he could have made the short journey down the East Lancs and met and married Rosanna.
It does state on his marriage cert Batchelor.
I have just received Michael Henrys death cert
1898 Henry Michael 56 Toxteth Park 8b 127
as this fits in with Rosanna being a widow on the 1901 census.
I was hoping for Rosanna to be named as the informant or someone else in the family.
Although disappointed yet again, and unable to tie my 2nd g grandfather down the death cert does make interesting reading;

Died- 30th December Royal Southern Hospital

Profession- dock labourer [off Norfolk St]

Signature/informant- certificate received from Tho. Edw. Sampson coroner for Liverpool-
Inquest Held 1st January 1898

Cause of death-Shock due to accidental Immersion in the Harrington Dock (1 hour)

Would be interesting to see if there were any newspaper reports of his accident.

[MaryA]

Would be interesting to see if there were any newspaper reports of his accident.

1898 doesn't appear in the listing for the Liverpool Mercury on the Old Newspapers site. It would need you to make a visit to the Record Office to check the originals on microfilm.

[dennison]

Thanks Mary, ill try and visit next time I take my mother back home to see her memories, we are overdue remembering her childhood during the blitz, the streets she played on and the friends she lost. Also we have new people and places to visit thanks to the help and information from members on this forum, it has given her a new lease of life since we started looking into our family;
Thanks Chris

[MaryA]

Lovely, she will so enjoy a visit back home, give her our regards.