currie rogers

[dickiesam]

A bit of a puzzle, but very interesting....

Re the 1881 census. There's only one Frederick Rogers born about 1872 +/- 2 years with a father Robert.
1881: RG11 - Piece 3673 - Folio 65 - Page 19
Address: 22 Atwell Street, Everton.
Robert Rogers Head 45 1836 Greenwich Pensioner - Liverpool
Catherine Rogers Wife 44 1837 - Ireland
Robert Rogers Son 14 1867 Apprentice Carpenter - East Indies
Frederick Rogers Son 7 1874 Scholar - West Indies
Alice Rogers Dtr 2 1879 - Malta
Joseph Whittingham Lodger Widower 69 1812 Boot Maker - Liverpool

If this is the right family Robert Rogers was in the British Navy or Marines and serving in the West Indies when Frederick was born there. That means his birth would not appear in the usual GRO Index. From the various locations of the children's births I think he could have been in the Marines.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenwich_pensioner

If this is the family, by 1891 Robert has died and we have actual places of birth...
RG12 Piece 2949 Folio 91 Page 31
Address: 16 Tynmouth Street, Everton.
Catherine Rogers Lodger Widow 53 1838 - Boyle, Co Roscommon, Ireland.
Fredrick Rogers Lodger U/m 17 1874 - Barbados, West Indies.
Alice Rogers Lodger 12 1879 Scholar - Malta
Henry Lawley Lodger Widower 28 1863 Police Constable - East Indies, [Rawul Pindee].

[Bertieone]

Hi DS,

Greenwich Pensioner, Navy or Marines?

[dickiesam]

Hi DS,

Greenwich Pensioner, Navy or Marines?

Just kicked myself! Should have thought but rushing to catch my favourite Saturday night drama! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenwich_pensioner

TVM and post amended. I think Marines.

[Bertieone]

Just a possible, Note, children started after last service date?


UK, Naval Officer and Rating Service Records, 1802-1919
about Robert Rogers

Name:
Robert Rogers

Birth Date:
abt 1838
Gender:
Male
Age at Start of Service:
18
First Service Date:
30 Aug 1856
First Ship Served On:
Pembroke
Last Service Date:
25 Oct 1866
Last Ship Served On:
Slaney
Record Type:
Entry Books of Certificates
Date Range:
1866 Sep - 1867 Aug

[dickiesam]

This doesn't fit with Robert Rogers being in the Marines unless he had a transfer, but I included the line in the 1891 census for Henry Lawley since he was born in India and I found this possible marriage for a Robert and Catherine..

Marriage: Robert Rogers [bachelor]
Occupation: Sergeant, 98th Regt.
Marriage date: 16 Apr 1865
Spouse's name: Catherine Lowley [Widow]
Place: Umballa, Bengal
Groom's age: 29

http://www.nam.ac.uk/research/famous-un ... iment-foot

The postings of the 98th Regt match the births of the 3 children.. India, Barbados in the West Indies and Malta. Could be a coincidence. And Catherine Lowley[?] and Henry Lawley[?] could be related? A son by her first marriage?

[dickiesam]

Could be up the wrong creek entirely.... but if the Frederick Rogers born in Barbados is the right one...

1910+1.....
29 Howat St Everton Liverpool
Frederick Rogers Head 37 1874 - Barbados - Carter
Elizabeth Rogers Wife 31 1880 - Chester, Cheshire -
Frederick Rogers Son 7 1904 - Liverpool
Norah Rogers Dtr 5 1906 - Liverpool
Robert Rogers Son 4 1907 - Liverpool

Marriages Jun 1902: Rogers, Frederick and Delaney, Elizabeth Emily - W. Derby 8b 800 [Register Office or Registrar Attended]

Deaths Sep 1914: Rogers, Elizabeth E 35 W.Derby 8b 683

[Bertieone]

This doesn't fit with Robert Rogers being in the Marines unless he had a transfer, but I included the line in the 1891 census for Henry Lawley since he was born in India and I found this possible marriage for a Robert and Catherine..

Marriage: Robert Rogers [bachelor]
Occupation: Sergeant, 98th Regt.
Marriage date: 16 Apr 1865
Spouse's name: Catherine Lowley [Widow]
Place: Umballa, Bengal
Groom's age: 29

http://www.nam.ac.uk/research/famous-un ... iment-foot

The postings of the 98th Regt match the births of the 3 children.. India, Barbados in the West Indies and Malta. Could be a coincidence. And Catherine Lowley[?] and Henry Lawley[?] could be related? A son by her first marriage?

Name:
Henry Lowley

Gender:
Male
Birth Date:
18 Oct 1862
Birth Place:
Rawul Pindee, Bengal, India
Baptism Date:
29 Oct 1862
Baptism Age:
0
Baptism Place:
India
Father:
James Lowley
Mother:
Cathrine

[Bertieone]

Name:
William Lowley

Gender:
Male
Birth Date:
11 Mar 1861
Birth Place:
Chr. Peshawur Bengal India
Baptism Date:
9 Apr 1861
Baptism Age:
0
Baptism Place:
Peshawur, Bengal, India
Father:
James Lowley
Mother:
Catherine

[Bertieone]

??????????

Name:
James Lowley
Gender:
Male
Marriage Date:
10 Apr 1857
Marriage Place:
Saint Phillip,Sheffield,York,England
Spouse:
Catherine Nors

1857, James Lowley, Catherine Noon, Sheffield 9c 423.

Speculative, can't find this couple on the following census, 1861, and not likely to if they were in India.

Was James Lowley in the 98th?

[Bertieone]

Catherine Noon
Age:
15
Estimated Birth Year:
abt 1836
Relation:
Daughter
Father's Name:
John Noon
Mother's name:
Catherine Noon
Gender:
Female
Where born:
Roscommon, Ireland
Civil Parish:
Sheffield
Ecclesiastical parish:
St Peter
County/Island:
Yorkshire
Country:
England
Registration district:
Sheffield
Sub-registration district:
South Sheffield

Name
John Noon 38
Catherine Noon 24
Catherine Noon 15
Mary Noon 6
Ann Noon 5
Patrick Cluny 36
Catherine Cluny 30
Catherine Cluny 7 Mo
John Crow 17
Michael Mc Cue 30

HO107 P2340 F451 P34

[Bertieone]

Name:
Alice Mary Rogers

Birth Year:
abt 1878
Age:
23
Marriage Date:
25 Dec 1901
Parish:
Everton, St Augustine
Spouse's Name:
Hugh Mitchell Robertson
Father's Name:
Robert Rogers, Plasterer, deceased
Spouse Father's Name:
Hugh Mitchell Robertson, Mariner, deceased

Witnesses, William Batty, Mary Ellen Lawley

[Bertieone]

Alice, baptised, 15 July, 1878, Garrison Of Malta,

Robert Rogers, Sergeant, 98 Reg
Mother, Catherine.

[curriesimpson]

My father informs me frederick was a sarg. In the army ( we have a pic of this, i rememberseeing it as a child as we only had 2 pics of him) and later a carter and his father was definately a plasterer, so alot ties up perfectly

[dickiesam]

Speculative, can't find this couple on the following census, 1861, and not likely to if they were in India.

Was James Lowley in the 98th?

You have been busy Bert! And yes, James was in the 98th.

Son Henry's baptism...
Henry Lowley
Birth date: 18 Oct 1862
Baptism date: 29 Oct 1862
Father's name: James Lowley
[on Register page.... Pte, H M 98th Regt]
Mother's first name: Catherine
Place: Christ Church, Rawal Pindi,
Presidency: Bengal

There appears to have been a prior baptism for young Henry on the 26th of October 1862 at St Patrick's Chapel, Rawal Pindi.

And son William....
William Lowley
Birth date: 11 Mar 1861
Baptism date: 9 April 1861
Father's name: James Lowley
[on Register page.... Pte, 98th Regt]
Mother's first name: Catherine
Place: Peshawar
Presidency: Bengal

[Bertieone]

Hi DS,

I'm beginning to think we can dismiss,

UK, Naval Officer and Rating Service Records, 1802-1919
about Robert Rogers

The above doesn't fit with Robert marrying Catherine in 1865 and him being in the 98th, so, mention of Greenwich Pensioner, 1881, has the enumerator messed up. Should it read, Chelsea Pensioner?

[dickiesam]

My father informs me frederick was a sarg. In the army ( we have a pic of this, i rememberseeing it as a child as we only had 2 pics of him) and later a carter and his father was definately a plasterer, so alot ties up perfectly

Hi Bert,
I too am wondering if we are chasing the wrong Robert Rogers with a son Frederick? Can you find anything on Frederick being in the Army and is his first marriage online? Marriages Jun 1902: Rogers, Frederick and Delaney, Elizabeth Emily - W. Derby 8b 800 [Register Office or Registrar Attended]

What was his occupation then because he may have been too old to have served in WW1? And he was a widower with young children after the death of Elizabeth in 1914.

And I am wondering if that photo referred to could actually be his father Robert? Would like to see the photo scanned and posted to see the style of uniform dress etc, to date it.

[Bertieone]

Hi DS,

Nothing online for the marriage, had a good go at that earlier, no Army records I could find either.

The same thought crossed my mind, the photo could have been Robert, wondering if its still available for posting, the uniform would soon tell us what period.

[dickiesam]

Hi DS,

Nothing online for the marriage, had a good go at that earlier, no Army records I could find either.

The same thought crossed my mind, the photo could have been Robert, wondering if its still available for posting, the uniform would soon tell us what period.

If Frederick was in the Army it would have been before his first marriage and that may be why I haven't yet found him in the 1901.

[dickiesam]

Also trying to find out what happened to Frederick's brother Henry and found this...
Deaths Dec 1899: Lawley, Henry [37] - W. Derby 8b 388
Exact match for YoB and area.

Since Henry was a widower in 1891 I looked for a marriage but only found this one...
Marriages Jun 1895: Lawley, Henry married McAllister, Mary Ellen - W. Derby 8b 623 at St. Saviour, Everton, Liverpool

And guess where he was in 1876! This has to be him....
Attestation:
Name: HENRY LAWLEY
Birth year: 1863
Birth parish: RAWAL PINDEE
Birth country: EAST INDIES
Regiment: North Staffordshire Regiment (The Prince of Wales's) - 64th & 98th Foot
Attestation place: Malta
Attestation date: 15 Aug 1876
Attestation age: 13 year and 10 months
Attestation Corps: 98th Foot
Attestation service number: 706
Discharge Corps: 98th Foot
Discharge Date: 16 Aug 1888.
Rank: Drummer

He married Lizzie Owen on the 15 Dec 1887 at the Register Office, Lichfield, Staffs.
Marriages Dec 1887: LAWLEY, Henry married Owen, Lizzie - Lichfield 6b 689
and sadly....
Deaths Mar 1891: Lawley, Lizzie [21] - Lichfield 6b 298
There does not appear to be any children to this marriage.

There several images of his service record on Findmypast. Unless you have a sub you will need to buy credits to view and print the images.

[Bertieone]

Mary Ellen Lawley was a witness at Alice Rogers marriage.

Frederick Rogers missing the 1901, can you check South Africa? DS.