Quick Question?? re Death Certificates

[erika]

Hi All

Am I right in saying that all deaths had to be registered?

If so, is it possible that a registration may have been missed out of the GRO's indexes?

I have searched and searched for my gt grandfather's death for years, keep coming back to it in the hope of finding him I am only looking at the early 1900s and it just doesn't make sense

Thank you

[MaryA]

Yes they did otherwise they shouldn't have been able to be buried. Have you checked for a burial? Why not give his dob and name and where you think he lived in later life, or what census you have him on, and perhaps we can check some cemeteries.

Is there any chance that he could have been entered into Workhouse Records or the Infirmary? there may be an entry referring to his death.

[erika]

Hi Mary

I am looking for Lachlan Hanlan Campbell born 16 Feb 1855 in Glasgow.

He lived in Coatbridge until 1901, I have all the Scotland Census 1861 - 1901.

The family appeared in Liverpool sometime after 1901. My grandfather ( Lachlan's son ) married my grandmother in Liverpool in 1906. According to marriage cert Lachlan was alive.

In the 1911 directory which I know is printed earlier Lachlan ( spelt Lochlan)engineer, is living at 118 Aubrey Street

The 1911 census has his wife Elsie Campbell and his youngest son Peter living still at 118 Aubrey Street
She is stated as widow.
On Peter's marriage cert in 1914, Lachlan ( spelt Laughlan ) as deceased.

There have been many variations of the spelling of Lachlan along the way and I have tried them all in my searches. Have also looked at passenger records without success.

Elsie died on 5 Nov 1930 in Mill Road hospital, she is registered under her proper name, Elspeth Campbell, (that was another major search with different names ) but I don't know where she is buried either.
Her son Peter registered her death and was living at 206 Phythian Street. (Another spelling here, widow of Lauchlin Campbell )
As far as I know they were not RC, but maybe in the past, who knows!

Workhouse and Infirmary records I don't know about, but not finding a death registration is a little puzzling

Thank you

[dickiesam]

Hi Erika,
RE:

The family appeared in Liverpool sometime after 1901. My grandfather ( Lachlan's son ) married my grandmother in Liverpool in 1906. According to marriage cert Lachlan was alive.

The lack of the word Deceased with the father's name does not mean he was definitely alive. It could be the Registrar didn't ask the question 'is your father alive'. Was Lachlan a sea-going engineer by any chance?

And found this on Scotland's People. Didn't have enough credits to check the full details though.
1906 - CAMPBELL, LACHLAN - 53 - CAMPBELTOWN/ARGYLL - SGRO ref 507/00 0097

[MaryA]

Register for AncestralScotland.com newsletter and you will get 10 free credits to use on Scotlands People.
http://www.ancestralscotland.com/newsletter/

[erika]

Hi DS

Thanks for your reply.
I have seen that death on Scotlands People in the past, along with all the other Lachlan Campbells Cost me a small fortune over the years

He was in the iron industry and one of his sons was born in Manchester too, which was odd, as it came between censuses in Scotland. Dashed down to Manchester had a son and then dashed back again. Took me ages to find that birth too. Talk about " The Campbells are coming"

Anyway as he was mentioned in the 1911 directory I imagined he must have been in Liverpool when my grandfather got married.


Thanks Mary for the tip. I've registered with them in the past and got a few credits along the way, very useful.

[Katie]

I know some deaths were not registered during the Blitz. So frustrating for you.

kathyd

[Hilary]

The 1911 directory would have been complied from information collected in 1910. The name of the head of the household listed for a particular house would be dependent on what was told to the person collecting the information or filling in a form.

[erika]

Thank you all for your replies and thoughts.
I really think I'm doomed with this search, he has been almost impossible to find for more years than I care to think about, but it's nice to have others to sound out.

I'm really grateful to you all

[louis]

Hi Erika

Have you searched for a Coroner's Inquest/Report? His death may have been accidental, and if it was, could have been registered some years after the death. A search of the Liverpool Papers, British Newspaper Archives and the Deaths at Sea Register may be worthwhile.

Was Lachlan known by any other names?

Louis

[erika]

Hi Louis

Thanks for your reply.
I don't know whether Lachlan was known by another name, all those variations in spelling of Lachlan would be enough to want to call yourself something else

I had this romantic notion that he disappeared, maybe drowned and a body was never found, so no death cert, but I think that was just a dream!
Unfortunately my own grandfather, Lachlan's son, died when my father was a young boy and my grandmother re-married. So although I'm a Campbell I never knew any of the family so am really struggling to fit everyone together and build my tree.

I've not looked at coroner's reports, not sure where to start with that one, and newspaper records from that period are not online and I'm not near enough to Liverpool to visit the record office.
Bit stuck really, but I suppose that's to be expected with this hobby

Thanks again for your views

[MaryA]

I've not looked at coroner's reports, not sure where to start with that one, and newspaper records from that period are not online and I'm not near enough to Liverpool to visit the record office.

Both of those records would require a trip to Liverpool as they are held at the record office.

[erika]

Thanks Mary, knew they would be, must plan another trip to Liverpool, just fitting it all in

[dickiesam]

If it wasn't for the fact that Lachlan's wife calls herself a widow in 1911 I would have assumed the possibility that Lachlan had died but was not identified. He would have been registered as Unknown Male in order for a cert to be issued and for the body to be buried. There are 4 male Unknown in the Index for Liverpool from June 1910 and March 911 with ages estimated as between 50 and 65.

It is possible Elsie called herself a widow in the census to avoid 'embarassment' if she and her son had been abandoned by Lachlan. Have you checked for a will?

[MaryA]

Probably not, likely too old, even if he had run off, but at those dates don't know how you could discount them.

1941 - Campbell Lachlan of St Trinneans Marine Road, Nairn died 30 September 1940 at Pitlochry Perthshire Confirmation of John Grant postmaster Alexander Heard grocer and John McDonald Solicitor. Sealed Llandudno 25 April.

1948 - Campbell Lachlan of Adsheaf 14 Russell Hill Purley Surrey died 15 October 1848 Probate London 18 December to James Young Finlay chartered accountant Joshua Wright Brown company director and Aylmer Gustavus Clerk solicitor. Effects £82,494 9s 9d.

[erika]

Hi DS

I did consider Lachlan leaving his wife and son behind, but having searched for deaths for later years as well and not finding anyone, was not convinced. Unless he changed his name, I can't think of anything else.
There is no sign of a will either.

Maybe if I can find Elspeth's grave, there could be a clue there, but not sure they would have a headstone in any case.
Not sure this is ever going to be cracked

[MaryA]

Was Elspeth's death registered by a hospital official rather than one of the family?

Forget that question, I just realised you answered it. No idea where the son was buried either then? or what religion they were?

I've just gone over old questions, take no notice of me Erika. No answers needed as you have already given them above.

[MaryA]

No obvious probate for son Peter either, sorry.

[erika]

Elspeth's death was registered by her youngest son Peter, who was living with her in the 1911 census.
I think maybe she was living with him and his wife and family at 206 Phythian Street.

Her son, my grandfather had already died, another son was killed in the war and 2 other sons I haven't found yet!

[erika]

A couple of years ago when the World Cup was on, there were some freebie lookups on a website ( can't remember which one) and I found a living relative, Peter's granddaughter in Blackpool.
I wrote to her on the off chance and she replied, very pleased to hear from me. She knew nothing at all about any family so was really surprised to know about all the brothers Peter had and was able to send me a photo of him, which was fantastic as I thought my Dad resembled him.

However she has no "stuff" which helps, didn't even know Peter's parents names, so am still back to square one!