William Chamney, Bn, 1894

[Bertieone]

Hi all,

Spot of bother with this chap.

He was born, 1894, Birkenhead.
Baptised, 14 March, 1894, Holy Trinity, Parents, William & Eliza Chamney
Married 1916, St Peter, Birkenhead, to Ellen Barker, Father, William Chamney.

I haven't got any certs, all info off Anc, etc.

Managed to find him in 1911, transcribed on Anc as William Channey, living with Joseph Iles and wife
RG14 Piece 21963.

I could do with finding him in 1901.

A possible connection could be this family living in Birkenhead.

1861, RG9 P2640 F29 Page52

William Chamney bn 1817, Ulverston
Eliza, wife, 1827,
Children,
I can't find this family in 1871 to see if the brood was added to and they had a William, possible father to William 1894.

Thank you.

[MaryA]

Do you know if William had siblings Frances Laura b 1903 and George Ledie b 1908 as there are baptisms listed for Tranmere and Lower Tranmere for them, I could look at these next week to see who their parents were.

But there isn't a baptisms listed for a William who could be William's father, but you know what transcriptions are like!!

[MaryA]

Looking for a death of a William who could have been his father, I don't find any except your William in Birkenhead, however there is one that might fit for age

Deaths Mar 1902
Chamney William 34 W. Derby 8b 436

Sorry can't find a burial on Ancestry to help with the address.

[MaryA]

If you are collecting Ulverston links then it might be worthwhile keeping the 1901 census on file for William Channey in Liverpool, who has both a married and unmarried sister and nephews and niece. RG13; Piece: 3500; Folio: 157; Page: 14

[dickiesam]

Re:

Do you know if William had siblings Frances Laura b 1903 and George Ledie b 1908 as there are baptisms listed for Tranmere and Lower Tranmere for them, I could look at these next week to see who their parents were.

Save you the lookup! May be related but not siblings...

Name: Frances Laura
Surname: Chamney
Christening Date: 05 Jul 1903
Father's Forenames: Albert Edward
Father's Surname: Chamney
Mother's Forename: Mary Elizabeth
Mother's Surname: Chamney
Record Group: Part 1 - 1; Record Number:198;
Parish: St. Paul
City or Town: Tranmere, Cheshire
Record source: Diocese of Chester parish registers of baptisms 1538-1910

Name: George Ledie
Surname: Chamney
Christening Date: 14 Jun 1908
Father's Forenames: Albert Edward
Father's Surname: Chamney
Mother's Forename: Mary Elizabeth
Record Group:Part 1 - 1; Record Number:437;
Parish: St. Luke
City or Town: Lower Tranmere, Cheshire
Record source: Diocese of Chester parish registers of baptisms 1538-1910

[dickiesam]

Do you have this possible sighting from 1891?

RG12 Piece: 2997 Folio: 107 Page: 46
Address: 76 Saxon Street, West Derby.
CHAMNEY, Richard Head 51 1840 Coach Painter - Bardsea, Lancashire
CHAMNEY, Sarah Wife 49 1842 - Dalton in Furness, Lancashire
CHAMNEY, William Son u/m 1867 Carter Master - Ulverston, Lancashire
CHAMNEY, Elizabeth Dtr 16 1875 Milliner - Barrow in Furness, Lancashire
CHAMNEY, Edith Dtr 12 1879 Scholar - Liverpool, Lancashire

[Bertieone]

Hi, Mary, DS, thank you both,

All I know on this chap is what I've put up, though as a young child he was the first dead body I'd seen lying in a coffin, not much help I know.
The Ulverston connection is not definite, mainly looking at possibilities for elimination purposes.


The 1891 census, Richard Chamney, and family I still can't find that on Anc, even with the ref number, looked at the 81 earlier for the same family but can't find a marriage between a William Chamney and Eliza around the time one would expect.

And where is William, 1894, in 1901? if that could be found , may well open a few doors.

[dickiesam]

Hi Bert,
That 1891 sighting I posted could be the wrong man. I think this is he in 1901...

RG13 Piece: 3500 Folio: 157 Page: 14
Address: 47 Sutton Street, West Derby
CHANNEY, William Head u/m 33 1868 Coachman Not Domestic - Wolverston [as transcribed, but I think it is Ulverston]
CHANNEY, Edith Sister 22 1879 - Liverpool, Lancashire

There are others in the household, mainly sibling sister and in-laws.

And can't find a marriage that fits for William and Eliza.

[Bertieone]

Cheers DS,
Single in 1901, That would eliminate him for a possible marriage, likely he was the William who died 1902, West Derby.

[dickiesam]

More grist.... Parish marriages found on You-know-where. Unfortunately there are no images. Brief transcriptions are available. May be useful?

CHAMNEY William 1631 Hawkshead Lancashire
CHAMNEY William 1631 Hawkshead Lancashire
CHAMNEY William 1724 Colton Lancashire
CHAMNEY William 1797 Dalton, Near Furness Lancashire
CHAMNEY William 1806 Ulverston Lancashire
CHAMNEY William 1834 Charlton Kent
CHAMNEY Wm Graves 1783 Ashford Kent
CHAMNEY ?? 1834 Dioceses of the Province of Canterbury
CHAMNEY ! 1628 Colton Lancashire

[dickiesam]

Re:

He was born, 1894, Birkenhead.
Baptised, 14 March, 1894, Holy Trinity, Parents, William & Eliza Chamney

The record shows DoB as Feb 13th. 1894 and father's occupation as 'Labourer'.
Home address: 28 Aspinall Street.

[MaryA]

The 1891 census, Richard Chamney, and family I still can't find that on Anc, even with the ref number,

Check against CHANCEY Bert.

[Bertieone]

Thanks Mary,
didn't try that one

Cheers for the address DS, exactly the area I would expected them to live, beginning to think William the father was fictitious, lack of marriage etc. Pondering whether the Eliza is Elizabeth born 1854, Birkenhead, daughter of William and Eliza, Ulverston. Elizabeth 1854 ended up in the workhouse 1911, could account for William 1894 boarding with the Iles, 1911. hmmm.

[dickiesam]

Actually Bert, I was thinking along similar lines about a non-existent marriage between William and Eliza but my money was on the mother being Elizabeth's younger sibling shown in the 1861 census...
Births Mar 1861: CHAMNEY, Eliza - Wirral 8a 423

[dickiesam]

In the interest of elimination can you find this marriage and her father's name etc?

CHAMNEY, Eliza married WALMSLEY, James
Registration district: Liverpool
Year of registration: 1890: Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Volume no: 8B; Page no: 233

I think this is the mother from the 1961 family, Age at death is correct.
Deaths Sep 1889: Chamney, Eliza 63 Birkenhead 8a 311

[dickiesam]

Just gathering grist.....
In that 1861 Chamney family there is a daughter Jane bn abt 1859 in Cheshire. There is only one Cheshire birth 1857 - 1860..

Births Jun 1859: Chamney, Jane Wirral 8a 441

Then there is this marriage:
CHAMNEY, Jane married OLIVER, Joseph
Registration district: Birkenhead
Year of registration: 1881; Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Volume no: 8A; Page no: 668

Her spouse is confirmed from the 1891 census where she says she is bn Chester. But given the only birth is the Wirral one, that has to be a slip.

[Bertieone]

In the interest of elimination can you find this marriage and her father's name etc?

CHAMNEY, Eliza married WALMSLEY, James
Registration district: Liverpool
Year of registration: 1890: Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Volume no: 8B; Page no: 233

I think this is the mother from the 1961 family, Age at death is correct.
Deaths Sep 1889: Chamney, Eliza 63 Birkenhead 8a 311

DS,

The Eliza/James marriage, the father is William Chamney, no image.

That is the correct death of the mother, probate, October 1889, £363 1s 1d.

Eliza Chamney, widow, 63. Cambridge Place. One of next of kin, Elizabeth Chamney, spinster.

[Hilary]

It would be interesting to see what the birth certificate says? They may not have lied to the registrar!

[dickiesam]

DS,
The Eliza/James marriage, the father is William Chamney, no image.

That is the correct death of the mother, probate, October 1889, £363 1s 1d.
Eliza Chamney, widow, 63. Cambridge Place. One of next of kin, Elizabeth Chamney, spinster.

Wonder if this is the daughter Elizabeth's marriage?
CHAMNEY, Elizabeth married STOREY, John at Holy Trinity, Walton Breck.
Registration district: West Derby
Year of registration: 1896; Quarter of registration: Apr-May-Jun
Volume no: 8B; Page no: 813

Don't know if this is significant or a GRO transcription/transfer error...
but according to the GRO Index in that 1916 marriage Ellen Barker married William CHARMEY not Chamney. Quite easy to see that it could have been a transfer error and a misread of the register entry.

[Bertieone]

I think the birth cert may well be sent for, curiosity is getting the better of me,

DS,
definitely a transcription error on Ellen Barker's marriage, my cousin John Chamney bn 1924, Birkenhead, 8a 714, had a son, my second cousin, Geoffrey W Chamney, 1951-1996, we went right through school together, even then the name error continued, he was called Chamley.

28 Aspinall Street, did you manage to take a walk down it in 1891/1901? difficult to do on Anc.