Liverpool & South West Lancashire FHS

Family History in the Hundred of West Derby
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PostPosted: 12:22:13 Thu 06/Jul/2017 
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Anyone know about old war memorials from churches?
In January I told Katie (of this group) that I would try to find out what had happened to the WWI memorial that used to be in St John's C of E Church in Waterloo, but all my enquiries with Liverpool Archdiocese and Liverpool Cathedral have run down. Nobody seems to know what happened to it.
Today the Cathedral Archivist suggested that Liverpool Record Office might know (or indeed, might have it - she said they had a collection of large objects.) This seems pretty unlikely to me. Anyone know if that angle is worth pursuing? If it was that easy, surely Katie would know about it already!
Barbara

==========
Some extra information about the memorial, and who I have asked.
Katie has a transcription of the names, so the information isn't lost.
St John's Church in Waterloo was closed and de-consecrated several years ago and is now being redeveloped for residential use.
The memorial definitely isn't still inside the old church building because I managed to get inside one day earlier in the year when some kids had broken open the side door. There is a scar on the wall of the transept where the memorial used to be. (Location in the transept confirmed by a parishioner.)
The current vicar of Christ Church / St. John's says he has a feeling that the memorial was moved into storage by the Diocese before the building was put up for sale.
I have had some conversations with Chris Leggett at the Diocesan Advisory Committee (which deals with buildings) who said he thought it might be in the Cathedral crypt and would ask the Vergers (but he never got back to me, despite a couple of reminders).
The Vergers sounded mystified and suggested the Cathedral Archivist.
And that takes us back to the top of the post!

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PostPosted: 18:03:38 Thu 06/Jul/2017 
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Sounds like you are going round and round in circles.

I would think it worth making a plea to say Roger Hull via the archives to see if he can make enquiries into any other departments in the Record Office, although as you say I'm not sure how likely this is but you can send him an email via the contact details on here, https://liverpool.gov.uk/libraries/arch ... y-history/.

Perhaps one of the museums? Karen O'Rourke might be contactable at the World Museum (Waterfront) and could perhaps suggest a likely person to make enquiries with the museums.

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PostPosted: 22:59:39 Thu 06/Jul/2017 
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This memorial is still listed by the National Inventory of War Memorials, now administered by the Imperial War Museum. I don't think they will be able to help, as they relay on information given to them.

Suggestion: find out from the diocesan HQ at St James's House (by the Cathedral) the name of the Area Dean and the Archdeacon responsible for the Waterloo area, then conact them. The a/d is the senior of the two. They should be aware of the circumstances.

Daggers

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PostPosted: 23:07:57 Thu 06/Jul/2017 
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Thank you both for the ideas. I will give them a try and let you all know.

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PostPosted: 19:43:59 Fri 07/Jul/2017 
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Paul Keogh laughed when I told him about War Memorials being stored at Liverpool Records. I will try and track this information down.

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PostPosted: 22:23:00 Sat 08/Jul/2017 
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In posting on Thursday I did not notice that area dean and archdeacon could be shortened to a/d . I meant that the archdeacon is the senior!
D

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PostPosted: 11:58:07 Tue 11/Jul/2017 
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I spoke to the Archdeacon's PA this morning, who will get back to me.

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PostPosted: 22:08:15 Sat 15/Jul/2017 
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The Archdeacon's PA did get back to me, and she asked if I had spoken to Chris Legget at the DAC because she'd spoken to him and he had a feeling he'd heard the question before. [Repressed gnashing of teeth at my end of the phone!] I said that was me, that he hadn't come back to me after several reminders, and I told her the other places I had tried. She took it all in. I asked why there wasn't a proper record and a proper system.
She promised to look into it further and ring me again.
I think this one sounds competent, so fingers crossed.
Barbara

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PostPosted: 10:08:42 Thu 20/Jul/2017 
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Good luck Barbara. It is so sad when historical items, especially those of remembrance, go missing. No excuse really.


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PostPosted: 11:22:43 Tue 01/Aug/2017 
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A little progress. I spoke to the Archdeacon's PA Miranda again this morning, and she says she has been liaising with Chris Leggett of the Diocesan Advisory Committee (he was the man I first asked, who didn't seem to be doing anything.)
Apparently Chris Leggett thinks it's in the Cathedral, he's seen something that looks like it, but he will be going back with a photo of the known memorial, to make a comparison and check it's right.
Those of you with an interest in these "retired" memorials - what should I ask when (fingers crossed) they say they have found and identified it? Should I ask for a reference number? Or the name of the person or department responsible should anyone want to view it? I believe that people and organisations keep old stuff like this in better condition and accessibility if they know people are interested and might ask again.

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PostPosted: 21:37:33 Tue 01/Aug/2017 
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Ask if there is a inventory of displaced Memorials. See if he is willing to let someone come and take pictures of them in order for us to identify which Church the belong to.

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PostPosted: 08:54:00 Wed 02/Aug/2017 
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Katie wrote:
inventory of displaced Memorials.

Now wouldn't that be something if there was one.

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Any census info in this post is Crown Copyright, from National Archives


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PostPosted: 10:01:32 Mon 11/Sep/2017 
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Not a dickie bird since my last posting, so this morning I have mailed Chris Leggett again, asking him how he is getting on with taking a photo to the Cathedral. I have also put to him the question about an inventory, and whether he would let them all be photographed. I emphasised that this is in the nature of assistance to him, as members here are very expert, and would be able to identify unattributed memorials from the names alone.
I'm not holding my breath (but not planning to give up, either!)

Barbara

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PostPosted: 10:29:31 Mon 11/Sep/2017 
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Success! He mailed me back almost immediately as follows
Hello Barbara
Please accept my apologies for not getting back to you sooner.
I have tracked down the War Memorial and I’m pleased to report that it is safely in storage in the cathedral. It is currently in the Organ Blower Chamber, which is easy to access but isn’t visited very often. This means that the stones are safe from being disturbed and will remain in good condition.
I have attached photos taken by a colleague as they are much better than mine! I hope this sets your mind at rest regarding this item.
I am not responsible for the care of these items but will make enquiries regarding inventory and possible visits for recording purposes and will be in touch shortly.
Best wishes, Chris


The pictures (of both the WWI and WWII memorials) are about half a meg each, and I will mail them to someone (Katie? Daggers?) on request. Would this be a convenient moment for me to bow out of this quest and pass over to someone who would want to visit the memorials and list and/or photograph them? Let me know and I will send you his e-mail address, and I think I also have his phone number. It might be a good idea to jump in quickly, while it's still on his mind!

Barbara

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PostPosted: 14:58:53 Mon 11/Sep/2017 
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Blue has detailed instructions on uploading photographs to your message,
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=15790
or you can forward the photos to me and I'll post them on this message.

This project is your baby, keep tabs on it and we'll help if we can.

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Names - Lunt, Hall, Kent, Ayre, Forshaw, Parle, Lawrenson, Longford, Ennis, Bayley, Russell, Longworth, Baile
Any census info in this post is Crown Copyright, from National Archives


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